Bmw 520d beats Toyota Prius in fuel economy test

Posted on by 32

You may wonder if this is a joke...well it isn’t! It is true! The 2.0 liter diesel engine of the Bmw showed better fuel economy than the well-known eco-friendly Toyota Prius. Some of you may see this camparison between the two cars ridiculous but if we look at the CO2 emissions of the two vehicles we see that there are almost equal: the Bmw delivers 41.9 mpg while the Prius, with almost 250 kg lighter, delivers 40.1 mpg.

The test between the two cars was made on the London-to-Geneva route. The Bmw equipped with a series of energy-saving features like the battery recharge when braking, good aerodynamics, low rolling resistance in a word the so-called EfficientDynamics showed no problems on the road and by the end of it also remained with a third of its tank in reserve.

Toyota Prius

The Prius ran out of gas but this happened only due to smaller tank and because the car is made for urban live. The advantage if hybrids can’t be seen on highway where the car is pushing through the wind, this can easily be seen in urban driving where the stop-and-go recaptures the car’s energy.

Now if we make a conclusion we can say that Bmw showed every one that its 5-series can beat also the eco-friendly Prius but what if the test would have been made inside a town...Would the Bmw be the winner?


32 comments:

Now,now. Don’t get all bitter on me. You still haven’t answered a number of my questions. Did you at least read the comparison test I was talking about?

I can see why you’re bored ak.

You mean it isn’t the same energy star rating as on my reefer?

Actually, I was hoping to get a reaction from you, which I did. It was an excellence award by the way given to a CAR manufacturer for 3 years running, bit different from your refrigerator one.They don’t hand out awards "Willy- Nilly", you know.

"How much is that Lotus?"

This coming from a guy trying to justify the higher price of a BMW against a econobox. The Lotus has nothing to do with this, by the way.

"Thanks for the info. It seems like you and I are the only ones in the World interested in this article."

Nope, only you are the one interested in a year old link. Iam just bored.

Very impressive ak. Tell me more about that Energy Star Rating. Is that the same kind I have on my refrigerator and the windows on my home?

How much is that Lotus?

Thanks for the info. It seems like you and I are the only ones in the World interested in this article.

The United States EPA has awarded Toyota Motor Engineering & Manufacturing North America, Inc (TEMA) with a ENERGY STAR Sustained Excellence Award in 2007, 2008 and 2009.

In 2007, Toyota’s Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) fleet average of 26.69 mpg-US (8.813 L/100 km; 32.05 mpg-imp) exceeded all other major manufactures selling cars within the United States. Only Lotus Cars which sold the Elise and Exige powered by Toyota’s 2ZZ-GE engine did better with an average of 30.2 mpg-US (7.79 L/100 km; 36.3 mpg-imp).

BMW Named Greenest Automaker-Again

Posted: 06 Sep 2009 02:32 PM PDT

The SAM Group today published its latest evaluation for the Dow Jones

Sustainability Indexes (DJSI). For the fifth consecutive year, it rated the

BMW Group as the leader in its industry, making it the worlds most

sustainable automobile manufacturer. The BMW Group is the only company in

the automobile industry to have been listed in this important

sustainability index family every year since it was established in 1999.

We are delighted that the BMW Group is super sector leader in the Dow Jones

Sustainability Index World for the fifth consecutive year.This proves once

again that we are well on our way to establishing sustainability as the

guiding principle for all our processes. We refined our sustainability

strategy in the first half of 2009 ? this was the next logical step and

another important milestone, said Dr. Norbert Reithofer, Chairman of the

Board of Management of BMW AG.

The Board of Management of the BMW Group declared sustainability one of the

companys core strategic principles back in 2000. At the BMW Group corporate

sustainability is firmly entrenched throughout the entire value chain: from

the development of fuel-saving and alternative vehicle concepts through

clean production processes to green recycling practices. The BMW Group also

accepts responsibility for its roughly 100,000 employees and is involved in

social projects outside of its plants.

In recent months the BMW Group has taken further important steps towards

further improving sustainability. Each and every proposal today is measured

against the corporate goal of sustainability. At the highest management

level a Sustainability Board was established in summer 2009. This board,

which comprises the entire Board of Management, determines the strategic

alignment for sustainability issues. Twice a year it meets to discuss and

adopt the strategies and activities proposed at operational level.

Further information on BMW Groups sustainability activities are available

at:

"Why did the Prius engineers select a gasoline engine? Was it because of public opinion brought about by all the inefficient diesels that have been manufactured in the past?"

Because the Prius was intended for America and the Japanese market. Nothing to do with public opinion. Toyota does make diesel engines for Europe. A gasoline was chosen because diesels don’t sell that well in the two markets. If hybrids were all that bad, like BMWM6 said BMW wouldn’t have come up with its own versions.

"Most of us know that awards don’t win competitions."

You were happy enough to mention that the BMW diesel won the green engine of the year.

Quality? The Prius can be bought with leather interiors, navigation and other features that usually found in a Lexus with near bulletproof reliability. They don’t hand out reliability awards "Willy- Nilly", you know.

"as the saying goes, "you get what you pay for"

22K for a base Prius that gets 50 odd miles is actually quite good. In fact given that hybrids are far more complex than diesels, one might be bold enough to say it is actually quite cheap. If more quality and luxury was required, there is always the Lexus hybrids.

Had you read more of my comments instead of focussing on this one, you might have seen that Iam actually a fan, as stated concerning a number of Audi engines, most notably the R8 V12 TDI which gets 39mpg highway while delivering 500hp and 738lb-ft torque.

If you are really interested in learning more about diesels, wikipedia has a very good report on that technology.

A few quotes from wikipedia: "Diesel engines have the highest thermal efficiency of any internal or external combustion engine....about 50 percent of all new car sales in Europe are diesel.....Diesel engines are more efficient than petrol engines of the same power, resulting in lower fuel consumption....diesel engines are much more efficient than gasoline (petrol) engines when at low power and at engine idle....Adjusting the numbers to account for the energy density of diesel fuel, the overall energy efficiency is still about 20% greater for the diesel version....The MAN S80ME-C7 low speed diesel engines use 155 gram fuel per kWh for an overall energy conversion efficiency of 54.4%, which is the highest conversion of fuel into power by any internal or external combustion engine."

A lot more information on diesels, including historical data, can be found at wikipedia and many other sites.

I suspect the hybrid Prius could be morphed into a near perfect hybrid if the right diesel engine was selected to replace its gasoline engine, awards and all. Most of us know that awards don’t win competitions. In addition, the Prius would have to improve on its quality, just as most cheap cars could as was pointed out concerning the VW. True, this would add to its price tag but, as the saying goes, "you get what you pay for". Finally, Prius engineers would have to learn how to simplify their design and this would be the most difficult task of all.

I think BMW proved its point when they won this competition, and that seems to be, "A luxury car doesn’t have to be a fuel guzzler." It is to BMW’s credit and that of their engineers that they chose a diesel engine to prove their point.

In light of the information given in wikipedia and instead of going to all the trouble of manufacturing a hybrid diesel, if one is interested in fuel economy, why not just use a straight diesel powered car and save all the complication?

Why did the Prius engineers select a gasoline engine? Was it because of public opinion brought about by all the inefficient diesels that have been manufactured in the past? Diesels are becoming more efficient, more powerful, and greener. Its easy to fool yourself into thinking a hybrid is better but the power to charge the battery packs must still come from fossil fuels.

exactly as AK is saying

and i dont buy BMW for therre fuel economy, yeah I know thats not responsible but a BMW is a BMW sure they are aiming for more environmentaly froendly image but the havent hitthe nail on the head

If diesel is so good how come BMW chose to put hybrid layouts in the 7 series and X6

ohh and one more thing so I save you the trouble I started off with a 7 letter word

"Starting off with the four letter words indicates you were already at the end of your rope when you began".

Actually, I believe I started off with who. Thats a three letter word. On crack?! Good deduction on your part. The ones on crack are usually the first ones to accuse others of that habit.

Good to see that you haven’t tried to deny some things. So I take it you are a BMW snob, an idiot and a moron on crack.

Nice word, by the way. Crack,hm.. sure you are not the one in third grade?

You also haven’t denied the VW diesel losing to a Prius. And your higher quality bit was a joke.

Note that BMW M6 also agrees with me and he actually happens to own a couple of BMWs.

I wonder what the average person will buy, a Prius or a BMW that costs twice as much with equal mileage? Hm, must a tough question for you. Lets not even mention the new Prius that gives better mileage than every other car in its segment.

Get off the "crack", stop sniffing diesel fumes and get a life. Judging by your long comments and use of a year old link, I doubt you have one.

New Study Finds Diesel Cars May Save Owners More Money Than Hybrids

IntelliChoice’s 2009 Hybrid & Diesel Car Survey shows most 2009 model-year hybrid and “clean diesel” vehicles deliver a lower cost of ownership compared to their gasoline-burning counterparts. The company concluded that clean diesel technology — included in the survey for the first time this year — could be a “game changer” in North America, especially if the Obama Administration adopts a tax program to encourage use of the fuel.

AK, You must have been a real poor student. Maybe you still are. Return to your first post below, and I quote from you, spelling mistakes, four letter words and all: "Who the f*ck gave anyone the idea that the 5 series will give a better gas mileage than the Prius?"

Starting off with the four letter words indicates you were already at the end of your rope when you began, but I’ll answer your question anyway. At the end of the economy test, you know - the one we’ve been discussing, it was found that "the BMW (520d) delivers 41.9 mpg while the Prius, with almost 250 kg lighter, delivers 40.1 mpg." Does this answer your question?

Your second comment, and I quote again from your post: "First this isn’t even a fair competition. Why?- because in order to get the full capabilties of the Prius, it would have to be driven around in urban areas to get its full potential in order for the batteries to recharge."

Ralph Kalal stated, as mentioned below, that, "Both cars were driven from London to Geneva, “using motorways and town driving.” That’s a direct route of 460 miles, but the newspaper added an additional 100 miles of urban driving, specifically to give the Prius an advantage through use of its hybrid drivetrain in the in-town setting in which it works best." So the test actually catered to the Prius’s stronger point, i.e. better economy in urban driving than highway driving. The trip actually was a fair competition and not as you suggest. You also state "...the Prius, it would have to be driven around in urban areas to get its full potential in order for the batteries to recharge." Are you actually suggesting that the Prius cannot recharge it’s battery pack during highway driving? Ridiculous!

Your third comment, and I quote: "Since the BMW runs directly on diesel, the people who testing the cars would not have been afraid to test it against the Prius in real driving situations."

AK, your third comment looks like something written by a third grade student on crack cocaine. When you sober up please take a close look at what you wrote and I’m sure you will agree. What is a car for if not for real driving situations? What better competition than one that is devised to mirror actual driving conditions?

Looking at this competition from all angles anyone would have to arrive at the same conclusion. The BMW, a heavier luxury car, beat the Prius, an economy car, in an economy competition and it didn’t run out of fuel!

good going ak

anyways these cars arent even comparable

Come now, 50cal. You still haven’t answered my question.

"rice burner engines (the same engine that gets awards) what does that make a four banger diesel anyway? a weed hacker or a work of art because it simply is a BMW?"

And what are you argueing about? That you are indeed a snob?

"I’ll bet you didn’t even compare the interior of the Prius with that of a VW, did you? Even though the VW is priced about the same as a Prius it actually uses real steel for seat rails, just like a real car rather than a golf cart."

Difference is, the Prius interior won’t fall off within 20K miles, even if the VW will have the "better interior".

And since you seem to be such a big fan of VWs, I don’t suppose you read the test conducted by Edmunds(a recent one, not a year old one) with a Prius, a VW TDI, a Fusion hybrid and a couple of others? Don’t worry, I suspect you were worshipping your diesel. Funny thing, the plasticky Prius beat out the VW in every test that was conducted winning by a substancial mileage difference.

"that the EUROPEAN BMW 118d ADVANCED DIESEL (predecessor of the BMW 520d) was NAMED 2008 WORLD GREEN CAR AT THE 2008 NEW YORK INTERNATIONAL AUTO SHOW,"

Iam sorry but you were the idiot(you are allowed to get mad) calling a award winning engine a rice burner when in fact it has scored more awards than your diesel.

And you still haven’t pointed out the time and date of my comment on the other link.

I suggest that you cool off, take a sniff of gas for a change instead of the diesel fumes you usually inhale.

"Maybe, just maybe, those Japanese engineers aren’t what they are cracked up to be......."

Ooh, lets blame the engineers for a coming up with the first mass produced family hybrid at a reasonable price. And so much for your "chucking out the battery" and all the other statements. Did you happen to read about the Prius having lowest operating cost and best retained value and what not? I guess not.

And did you hear about a certain hybrid which actually topped the sales chart for any model in Japan? A hybrid being the best seller. I suppose the Japanese are not so smart?

"Then we could discuss any differences of opinion in a more calm and intelligent manner."

Coming from a guy whose comments are littered with cheap shots. Blaming engineers, comparing quality against a car that costs almost twice as more and what not.

Hard to expect anything from you.

Its ok for AK47 to mention an award that was presented 12 years ago for the Prius but not ok for a couple of readers to mention that the Prius had been road tested during the past year (which indicates it was not designed just for urban trips), or that the EUROPEAN BMW 118d ADVANCED DIESEL (predecessor of the BMW 520d) was NAMED 2008 WORLD GREEN CAR AT THE 2008 NEW YORK INTERNATIONAL AUTO SHOW, or that this particular economy race between a BMW 520d and a Prius actually contained "an additional 100 miles of urban driving, specifically to give the Prius an advantage through use of its hybrid drivetrain in the in-town setting in which it works best".

What kind of thought process is involved in your argument, AK? Apparently very little. And please tell us what you are arguing about?

You can always tell when someone’s losing it. He grabs for the four letter words, preferably of one syllable, to try and push his point, whatever that may be in this case.

Also, AK, As this discussion has proceeded, I’ve noticed that your spelling deteriorates more while your sentences make even less sense than they did at first. I’m worried about you AK. Go outside and take a walk to cool off, so you won’t get so confused. Then we could discuss any differences of opinion in a more calm and intelligent manner.

I’ll bet you didn’t even compare the interior of the Prius with that of a VW, did you? Even though the VW is priced about the same as a Prius it actually uses real steel for seat rails, just like a real car rather than a golf cart. Not only that, it outperforms the Prius, just as the heavier BMW does. Additionally, the VW TDI gets excellent mileage, generally 43-56 mpg in mixed driving, and it doesn’t require a revamping of the entire World transportation infrastructure to support it.

AK47 quote: "If a hybrid was all that bad, BMW wouldn’t have come up with the all electric MINI."

AK, an all electric car is not a hybrid.......however, if BMW is researching it then it must be a good thing.

A comment on the race: "...and by the end of it (the BMW 520d) also remained with a third of its tank in reserve.....The Prius ran out of gas but this happened only due to...." Even you must admit, AK, this statement is hilarious! Especially considering the Prius is an economy car while the BMW is more of a luxury car. Does it really matter why the Prius ran out of fuel while the BMW 520d did not? Maybe there was a leak?? Maybe it was poorly designed with too small of a fuel tank for the engine?? Maybe, just maybe, those Japanese engineers aren’t what they are cracked up to be.......

THE FACT IS, THE PRIUS RAN OUT OF FUEL DURING AN ECONOMY RACE. So funny!

Another quote from this race: "BMW delivers 41.9 mpg while the Prius, ...almost 250 kg lighter, delivers 40.1 mpg"

AK, you’ve been beaten fair and square, just like the BMW 520d beat the Prius fair and square. Be a man and admit it.

I suppose we could melt down the BMW and make several Prius’s out of it. Would this make you happy? Could three Prius’s be as good as one BMW? Hmmm..... Nah!

Uncia quote: "Has anybody mentioned that the Prius used in this test was a second generation, and not the all-new 2010 model? According to Autoweek, they averaged 74.5 mpg in their test of mixed driving, which would easily have put it ahead of the BMW."

I saw the autoweek post of 2/2/09 where Toyota itself claims 65 mpg in the 2010 plug-in Prius hybrid. It sounds real good even at 65 mpg for combined gasoline and electric mode tests. There is a huge difference in mileage obtained from a Prius, depending on how it is driven. This is a quote from that Autoweek article: "That difference is just magnified, supercharged, turbocharged with a plug-in electric because how fast you go really pulls the current out of the battery. It is a big deal." That would also make a big difference.

Any hybrid can go unlimited miles per gallon if you can plug it in and recharge every 40 miles or so, not use the backup fossil fuel engine, and don’t count the fossil fuel needed to generate the electricity to recharge the battery packs.

Have you seen the press release on the Chevy Volt? GM is claiming 230 mpg!

"Has anybody mentioned that the Prius used in this test was a second generation, and not the all-new 2010 model? According to Autoweek, they averaged 74.5 mpg in their test of mixed driving, which would easily have put it ahead of the BMW."

I would but this is funnier. This guy’s using a year old link to practise his essay writing skills. Especially hilarious when he uses the same old link to try and prove I dislike BMWs.

N
that BMW had received The 2008 World Green Car Award. Quite an achievement, eh?"

SO? Didn’t the Prius get the green engine of the year? Along with a $hit load other awards. Like these

1997–98 Car of the Year Japan[151]
2003 Scientific American names Toyota Motor Corporation as "Business Leader of the Year" ("Scientific American 50"; December, 2003) for its singular accomplishment in the commercialization of affordable hybrid cars.
Motor Trend Car of the Year, 2004[19]
Car and Driver magazine’s Ten Best list for 2004.
North American Car of the Year award for 2004. Nominated in 2001.
International Engine of the Year for 2004.
"Best Engineered Vehicle for 2004" by SAE’s Automotive Engineering International magazine.[152]
2005 European Car of the Year (406 points, ahead of Citroën C4 with 267 points and Ford Focus II with 228).[153]
2006 EnerGuide Award (Midsize)[154]
2006 Intellichoice Best Overall Value of the Year, Midsize[155]
2007 Intellichoice Best in Class Winner :Best Retained Value, Lowest Fuel, Lowest Operating Costs, Lowest Ownership Costs[156]
Swiss government named Toyota Prius the world’s greenest car in a draft study of over 6,000 cars.[157]
Green Engine of the Year 2008 from International Engine of the Year Awards.[158]
2008 Nominated for Car of the Year Awards 2008, shortlisted for the UK’s top Green Car Awards
JD Power and Associates "Most Dependable Compact Car" for 2008[159] and 2009[160].

Please read carefully, that alone should cancel your theories, about plasticky interiors, rice burner engines (the same engine that gets awards) what does that make a four banger diesel anyway? a weed hacker or a work of art because it simply is a BMW?, all the inferior bits that stick on longer than BMWs.

And read the one about the affordable hybrid comments? If a hybrid was all that bad, BMW wouldn’t have come up with the all electric MINI.

"Besides if we go to the quality thing I suspect we can’t compare a $50,000 car with a $23,000 car and expect the same quality."

Uh, son, you were the one comparing the two. Remember your "check out the plastic seat rails" comments?

And can you point out the other comment I made on the other link and post the date as well?

Running away? Ah, if only it were possible for a person to scare me away with a snob stick.

Has anybody mentioned that the Prius used in this test was a second generation, and not the all-new 2010 model? According to Autoweek, they averaged 74.5 mpg in their test of mixed driving, which would easily have put it ahead of the BMW.

Hi AK, I thought I lost ya. But it does look like you’re running away, judging by your "final" comment. You’re probably right

in that I do get a little wordy sometimes especially when the facts are ignored and they must be pointed out again and again.

Apparently we both think its significant when a heavier car, regardless of whether its a BMW, Ford, or Ferrari, beats a Prius

fairly in a mileage contest, given that the Prius was actually designed to be an economy car while the BMW is more luxurious

and better handling.

If the Prius was designed only to be an urban car, as you suggest, why is it fitted with an engine that is 4 times the size

needed to simply recharge the battery pack for urban driving? This indicates that the designer did intend for it to be driven

on the highway too. Given this, it seems infinitely fair that the economy test included highway segments as well as urban

segments. If you still doubt the Prius was meant to travel the highways just do a google search on MotorWeek Road Test: 2010

Toyota Prius. Don’t believe all the hype at this site either but at least you will see the car being driven on highways.

There are many other road test sites for the Prius.

Its nice to see you do have a sense of humor, making believe there was no urban segment in the contest. Recall the other link

you commented on? The one started by Ralph Kalal? It stated that, "Both cars were driven from London to Geneva, “using

motorways and town driving.” That’s a direct route of 460 miles, but the newspaper added an additional 100 miles of urban

driving, specifically to give the Prius an advantage through use of its hybrid drivetrain in the in-town setting in which it

works best." Now this is mentioned at least twice on this link, also which contradicts what you just stated below.

With the additional 100 miles of urban driving, ostensibly to quiet those who would think the contest unfair, how many urban

miles do you think were involved in the entire trip? 50% of the total? More than that? Less? How many?

Who knows if the drivers in America will eventually become sophisticated enough to buy more modern diesels or continue to

fall for the hype put out by the sellers of hybrids? I suppose they would if it weren’t for all those obnoxious misleading

addies that downplay the part about still needing a gasoline engine as a back up, for highway trips, and to recharge the

battery pack. The newer Prius will eventually be built even more like a golf cart, however, and you will be able to recharge

the battery pack with an extension cord. It will still use fossil fuel even with this modification though, unless all your

electrical power is provided through wind, nuclear, or solar energy. As you know, most electrical energy is produced from

coal &/or oil. And the Prius will still have that darned back up gasoline engine. Therefore it will continue evolving into a

more and more complicated electro-mechanical contraption.

In any case, AK, I’m glad to see that you’re finally coming around to my way of thinking but you still didn’t acknowledge

that BMW had received The 2008 World Green Car Award. Quite an achievement, eh?

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